Wends v Bristow & Sutor

[WendyB]

Right then. Long story short. Owe some council tax, a little bit from current year and some from last year. Liability orders on both. Came to a payment arrangement with council (they are quite nice, actually). Missed December's instalment, rang to pay it on 11th Jan to be told it had been sent to Bailiffs. Was told that they wouldn't get it back, but agreed a new instalment plan and said they would inform bailiffs and tell them not to visit and not to charge. Rang bailiffs next day, they said no record but would be in touch. Had nothing from bailiffs so rang council on 28th Jan to pay the instalment. Was told that Bristow & Sutor had made a visit the week before and left forms to fill in, Complete load of rubbish! Council were annoyed to find that Bristow & Sutor had apparently cancelled the payment arrangement and said she would get it sorted. made payment direct to Council.
Fast forward to last night when Ii arrived home to find that a bailiff had called and left a letter for me with my daughter!
Anyway, rang the Council this morning, explained situation, they were even more helpfult his time, rang me back and read out verbatim from their screens what had happened and confirmed that they had indeed instructed the bailiffs to accept instalments and not make any charges. Aplogised profusely. I faxed them a letter detailing timeline and events, and true to her word, they rang me back, confirmed my version of events and have faxed me a confirmation letter.

I have emailed and faxed Bristow and Sutor a letter and a copy of the letter from Council. The main bit of the letter to Bristow and Sutor is below. Let's see what happens next......




Please see attached letter from xxxx Senior Recovery Officer, xxxx MBC.

I will be making instalments as specified, of £114 and £20 respectively as agreed with xxx MBC and detailed in the attached letter. I am aware that these instructions have been passed on to yourselves twice now and am advised by Julie that any charges to my account from yourselves are to be withdrawn, as instructed.

You have further been notified that should the arrangement not be maintained that you are to refer the account to the Council Tax Recovery Unit for a decision as to any further action required. In light of this, please contact your bailiff Annette xxxx and instruct her not to carry out any further visits to my home. For your ease of reference, her mobile number is 07970xxxxxx. I trust you will be in touch with her immediately to ensure that no further unnecessary visits are made. Should your bailiff visit my home again with regards to this matter please be advised that I will consider it harassment and will lodge a Formal complaint.
I trust this brings this matter to a conclusion and expect your written confirmation by post shortly.

[Amy]

Re: Wends v Bristow & Sutor

The point is Wendy, that the bailiffs behave in this way because the councils do not do anything to stop them. The councils think by turning a blind eye that this absolves them of any and all responsibility and this is not only incorrect it is plain wrong and unjust. The bailiffs fleece people for many hundreds of pounds sometimes and yet the councils do absolutely nothing.

For example, the bailiff companies are fully aware they cannot charge a levy fee in the recovery of council tax unless and until there has been peaceful entry granted, but they carry on charging these fees regardless because there is nobody to stop them.

The councils must stop this behaviour, but they will not because they are staffed by stupid, apathetic people and people will not complain to them.

Your local council assured you this would not be sent to the bailiffs, so as nice as you think this Julie is, she is not, she is an idiot and you need to be complaining about the council not only the bailiffs.

[WendyB]

Re: Wends v Bristow & Sutor

Yes I know that Amy and I have taken it on board. With my letter to the council I enclosed a copy of the letter from the bailiffs and pointed out all the bits that were wrong. I also pointed out the bit about the council being vicariously liable etc etc. At the end of the day, I do owe the council tax, I have defaulted on the instalments and I have to pay it. Whether I pay it to Bristow & Sutor of the council makes no odds, I have no intention of, and will not, pay any erronoeous charges. Council did not say it wouldn't be sent to bailiffs, they said it hasd already been sent but would ensure that no charges were made because I had runbg them (after it had been sent) and they had agreed a payment arrangement, which to be fair she has now re-iterated with the bailiffs.

Yes bailiffs are barstewards and yes the councils don't always do as they should, but I am in a position to challenge it and I will do so. I am fortunate in that I know how they operate and am not easily taken in by them.. But I also think I should tell it the way it is and can only go by my own experience, which tbh isn't that bad so far, but only because of what I've learned from you. And if what I learn can be passed on to to others then that can only be good.
Wends xx

[WendyB]

Re: Wends v Bristow & Sutor

Well blow me down with a feather!!!!! Just checked my emails and received this at 3.29pm yesterday...to say I am gobsmacked is an understatement lol

Dear madam

We do apologise some letter were sent to you yesterday 10/02/10 which are incorrect. Please ignore these once received.

SAN-T 11xxxx – agreement on this account £xx.00 by 28/02/10 then 1 month at £xx0. Then to contact us to review this.

SAN-T 11xxxx – agreement is actually £xxx to reach us by 28/02/10 then £xxx by 28/03/10.

We do apologise for any inconvenience this may have caused you.

Yours faithfully
Miss S xxxxxx
Recovery Officer
Bristow & Sutor

[gwilliamson]

Re: Wends v Bristow & Sutor

I have had personal dealings with Bristow & Sutor and know exactly how they operate , to a degree and how the councils may appear to be 'doing the right thing' for the resident , they really pull the strings and like Amy says , turn a blind eye. You should feel honoured Wendy , that you recieved such a response from this company. They usually treat members of the public with contempt and often lie to them to gain 'peaceful entry' as in doing so , they can gain more funds for their company , via charges. If any of this has appeared on the forums before , i need to apologise , only just found and joined this website. Like many other residents , yes , we have no problems paying our council tax and like yourself , get very annoyed at the prospect of even more charges , usually caused by some prat's ineptitude , ignorance and greed. But people like ourselves can deal with these neanderthals , but what about the most vunerable? they usually do not have internet access nor do they have any idea of how to deal with situations like this. NOW is the time for the legislation , regarding the powers councils have , regarding the process of liability orders , to include protection from intimidation by the companies that councils use , yes i know that there is something in the administration act covering this, but it is clearly not enough. Or when councils send out council tax bills , shouldn't they have this information within to help and advise their council tax payers , rather than often having it hidden within small print on the bill. Including vital contacts if they are having trouble , because lets be honest , we all go through that at some point in our lives. There are to many gray area's within the legislation , too many loopholes that these companies and councils know about , what chance has a resident of gaining the correct information if they don't know who to contact nor what is the right question to ask. It's about time that those effected got together to have their MP's lobby parliament on this issue. Or do councils prefer to investigate themseves when someone does complain , a case of the tail wagging the dog surely. I am campaigning to have companies , like Brisow & Sutor , not only monitored properly , but investigated properly , via my own website. Currently recieving and waiting for councils in England regarding a FOI request i have sent to each and every one of them (well got to start somewhere) and take it from there. I am only now finding out about other sources that not only help with advice on this issue , but also instances of wrong doings by companies such as Bristow & Sutor , the more examples , the stronger the case when making the point to the relevent contacts. So basically i am doing research on this (no doubt others have tried in the past). But that doesn't mean we should give up trying , so any information would be gratefully recieved (either previous attempts or complaints past or present).

[WendyB]

Re: Wends v Bristow & Sutor

Yes I can see your point, up to a point. But if all the help, legislation and loopholes were included on the council tax bill, then this would just be an excuse for the less morally inclined people to not pay their council tax then use the law to wangle out of not paying and not be bought to account. Because lets face it, there are plenty of people who's reason for not paying is because they don't want to, and tbh these are the type of people who actually should be hssaled by bailiffs, have levies/distress etc. Unfortunately the council and bailiffs ave no way of knowing the "nice" debtors from the plain old council tax evaders, do they?

[WendyB]

Re: Wends v Bristow & Sutor

Just an update on this. I am completely up to date with this year's Council Tax, paying by DD on the 28th of each month (the day after payday). I am paying the arrears @ £40 per month by standing order to Bristow and Sutor. No extra charges, no admin fees or the like. I really don't care who the money gets paid to as long as it's paid and doesn't cost me anything extra or give me any grief, which it doesn't. I have 7 more payments of 40 then a final payment of 16, so by the end of May next year I will see the back of B & S forever.

Have to say, I was always a bit lax about Council Tax before, but the last couple of years, having had attachment of earnings, then the bailiffs, have taught me to give it the priority it deserves.

[Foundry]

Re: Wends v Bristow & Sutor

Really happy to read that you have managed to sort this out relatively painlessly.

However, I must agree with gwilliamson. This is a company who routinely defraud, cheat and bully those in financial difficulty.

This is nothing less than organised crime, endorsed, supported and encouraged by the very organisations who are charged with SERVING the same people they are shamelessly abusing.

Fortunately, we have the wherewithall to stand up and be counted. BUT there are many who do not have this ability. There are many who are vulnerable and who our local authorities have a sworn duty to PROTECT from exactly this kind of immoral, disgraceful victimisation.

Nobody argues that we must all pay our dues. But is (metaphorically) mugging a little old lady in the street really the way to go about it? Because there is no difference between this and the way bailiffs operate.

MOST people who fall into arrears with Council Tax etc do so because they are having financial difficulties NOT because they are low-life freeloaders looking to get out of paying.

We have to start getting the message across that being in financial difficulty is NOT A CRIMINAL OFFENCE and as such, people do not deserve to become VICTIMS of crime as a result.