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Skeleton Argument?

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  • Skeleton Argument?

    Hello
    Sorry if this is in wrong section but cannot get any replies on thread I had started a while ago.
    Just need to know do I need a skeleton argument and what exactly it is, have sent WS in and thought that was it until the hearing.
    Thank you
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: Skeleton Argument?

    Has the court ordered a skeleton argument ?

    Are you in the fast track ?

    I'll see if I can find your old thread, is there a copy of your defence and WS on there?


    Ok this is for a PCN - http://legalbeagles.info/forums/show...846#post740846
    #staysafestayhome

    Any support I provide is offered without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

    Received a Court Claim? Read >>>>> First Steps

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    • #3
      Re: Skeleton Argument?

      So you don't really need a skeleton - the case is small claims track - and your argument is that you were not the driver at the time of the alleged offence.

      Skeleton can be useful for your own use though spelling out the legal arguments and what you want to argue in the hearing.

      Did you get a witness statement off of the claimant so you have an idea what their arguments are.

      Parking isn't really my area ( at all!) so I don't know if there is a legal requirement to disclose who was driving.

      Seems not
      a keeper sent a Schedule 4 notice has no legal obligation to
      name the driver
      as well as this
      7. This claim predates keeper liability legislation (protection of freedoms act 2012). There is no presumption in law that holds the keeper liable and in any event none is pleaded. The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA 2012) which came into force in October 2012 is the only legislation currently available allowing a private parking firm to hold a registered keeper liable. From the limited information provided by the particulars of claim, it can be seen the date of the alleged incident is 5/11/2011 which predates the enactment of PoFA 2012. This being the case, the claimant cannot hold the registered keeper liable, only the driver, of which no evidence has been produced.

      I think you might need to strengthen this -
      8. I have never driven to this particular car park ever. Having learned to drive and passing my driving test later in life had made me a very cautious and nervious driver and I do not drive now for that reason. As the exit to this particular car park was and still is very busy I would never park there and would park elsewhere in the area and walk to the precinct.
      Offence was 5th Nov 2011? Any way of looking back at photos etc to jog memory what you were doing ( fireworks night etc )

      Also

      Don't or didn't have named drivers on insurance as at that time anyone who borrowed my car had their own insurance covering them to drive another person's car, I always made sure of that but can't remember all those years ago who was driving.
      check the legislation at the time that that is a valid argument and you can counter any thing by the claimant stating only you are insured on the vehicle.

      Also, although you are protected some by being in small claims track there is still a costs risk if the court finds you are acting unreasonably in defending the claim - just something you should be aware of as in extreme circumstances it can still add up to a few Łk.

      [MENTION=49370]Kati[/MENTION] [MENTION=5354]mystery1[/MENTION]
      #staysafestayhome

      Any support I provide is offered without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

      Received a Court Claim? Read >>>>> First Steps

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      • #4
        Re: Skeleton Argument?

        From another thread
        Have you ID'd the driver (at the relevant time) at any stage?
        If not, are you confident of the Elliot v Loake, CPS v AJH Films arguments?
        How would you answer if the Judge asked "Were you the driver?" (It has been known for this to happen).
        CAVEAT LECTOR

        This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

        You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
        Cohen, Herb


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        gets his brain a-going.
        Phelps, C. C.


        "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
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        • #5
          Re: Skeleton Argument?

          It is a suggestion and recommendation on another forum that, even on small claims, a skeleton argument is sent so that the judge knows what is about.

          I would think that a relevant response on being questioned about knowledge of the driver is that you could not possibly recall after this amount of time. Who keeps insurance docs for more than 6 years ? And bring up the fact that anyone with their own insurance can drive with your permission.

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