Car impound and speeding ticket help.

[Milesy123]

So this morning my wife got pulled over in my car for no insurance. I've only had the car 4 week so the first payment came out my bank so as far as I was aware I was insured. I've had no letters or emails telling me my insurance was going to be cancelled. Apparently the underwriters of Adrian Flux have gone bust and a lot of policy's got cancelled on the 16th of December. Who's at fault? I've now got to fork out £150 impound charges on Tuesday morning and my wife is going to get 6 points on her licence and a £300 fine. What should I do?

Next question.
To top my day off I received a letter from Bradford majestrates saying I'm due in court on the 24th of March. There is 2 speed camera tickets on there and 2 offences for failing to supply information about the car and driver but this is the first letter I have had corresponding to any tickets because they must have been sending them to my old address. The reason I know this is because they have stuck a white sticker over my old address with my new address on. I changed my licence with Dvla as soon as I moved so surely I shouldn't be prosecuted for failing to supply if it's there error.
Hope someone can help me out a little as to what to say or do next. Tia

[wales01man]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

did you change the v5 address as well as licence?

[Milesy123]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

Yes.

[wales01man]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

You may have to prove when the change of address was?

[paulajayne]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

What is the date of the docref on the V5?

[Milesy123]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

I don't have that car anymore. I've had my new car 4 weeks but the tickets were in my old car.

[wales01man]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

To defend you will need the dates to argue your case as for the No insurance you may have a valid defence my Police friend suggest you take it to court and seek a Solicitors advice or pay up and take fine points and costs

[charitynjw]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

Re the speeding tickets.

A Notice of Intended Prosecution (NIP) must be sent to the registered keeper within 14 days of the offence.
The police need to show due diligence in obtaining the correct address.
However, if the old address was on the DVLA database at the time of sending the NIP, & the police used the address as supplied, it may not be a bar to prosecution, as due diligence is satisfied.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/t...?h=6&t=1580295

Wilkinson's Road Traffic Offences said:Where the police made inquiry of the Motor Licences Department (now the DVLA) in good time but were given wrong information, it was held that they had shown reasonable diligence and their failure to send the notice to the correct person was in those circumstances no bar to conviction (Clarke v Mould [1945] 2 All E.R. 551; see also Rogerson v Edwards above, and Carr v Harrison, The Times, November 18, 1966, the only report on this point, where it was held that the police in approaching the licensing authority in good time had shown reasonable diligence, though the authority had been slow in supplying the information). This paragraph should be read in conjunction with § 2.202 in cases of accidents.
2.217

Where the police were supplied with the wrong name of the registered keeper at the relevant time and accordingly sent the notice to the wrong person at the wrong address, this failure to send a notice to the registered keeper is no bar to conviction because they will have shown due diligence under s.2(3) (Haughton v Harrison [1976] R.T.R. 208). Once the police have established under s.2(3) that their failure to serve a notice is no bar to a conviction, the police are under no duty to serve any further notices as soon as they are told of the correct name and address of the registered keeper (ibid.).

[des8]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

For he "no Insurance" incident was your wife given a FPN/

You could elect not to accept that and let the case go to court.
As there is strict liability to ensure one is driving with insurance in place, this might be a risky move, but the law does allow the magistrate discretion if he can show there was a "genuine and honest" belief he was insured and there were reasonable grounds for so believing (Rennison v Knowler (1947))
Reasonable grounds includes where the insurance has been cancelled without the insured's knowledge

This may enable her to avoid the points on her licence, but I would suggest you consult a specialist solicitor before taking that course.


On a slightly different tack, have you had confirmation that Flux have gone into administration, as I can't find anything on the internet about it.
Or is it the insurers that Adrian Flux placed your business with, who have gone bust and Flux is still in business?

- - - Updated - - -

For he "no Insurance" incident was your wife given a FPN/

You could elect not to accept that and let the case go to court.
As there is strict liability to ensure one is driving with insurance in place, this might be a risky move, but the law does allow the magistrate discretion if he can show there was a "genuine and honest" belief he was insured and there were reasonable grounds for so believing (Rennison v Knowler (1947))
Reasonable grounds includes where the insurance has been cancelled without the insured's knowledge

This may enable her to avoid the points on her licence, but I would suggest you consult a specialist solicitor before taking that course.


On a slightly different tack, have you had confirmation that Flux have gone into administration, as I can't find anything on the internet about it.
Or is it the insurers that Adrian Flux placed your business with, who have gone bust and Flux is still in business?

[wales01man]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

Any ideas on speeding tickets DES IMO and from a traffic cop it appears the V5 address was not changed at DVLA by OP

[des8]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

Any ideas on speeding tickets DES IMO and from a traffic cop it appears the V5 address was not changed at DVLA by OP

I doubt there is much that can be done other than plead for mercy!
It seems the speeding offence, change of address and notification to DVLA all occurred at the same time.
So police sought name and address just prior to records being updated, and the NIP was not received.
All the police need to do is show they sent out the NIP in time to reach the registered keeper withn 14 days barring "unusual events".
If OP does not dispute the actual offences a call to the issuers might get the opportunity to accept a FPN and have the court summons withdrawn.

[Milesy123]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

Right here goes. I'm not brainy when it comes to things like this so all these abbreviations don't mean nothing to me lol. But from what I can understand if I can prove to the court I had no idea my insurance was cancelled I should be fine yes? As I've just been on My Premium Credit which is an online portal to view the credit agreement and it quite clearly shows my old address for the insurance so therefore if they had sent any letters I wouldn't have received them. I know 100% I changed my address over the phone on the same day as taking out my new policy for the new car. So Adrian flux are at fault as long as I can be sent a copy of the recording I should be fine. If I request a copy of the phone call do the have to send me it legally? Thank you everyone.

[des8]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

Right here goes. I'm not brainy when it comes to things like this so all these abbreviations don't mean nothing to me lol. But from what I can understand if I can prove to the court I had no idea my insurance was cancelled I should be fine yes?Not necessarily ... a lot depends on what side of the bed the magistrates got out off. That is why I suugested a solicitor who canargue for you! As I've just been on My Premium Credit which is an online portal to view the credit agreement and it quite clearly shows my old address for the insurance so therefore if they had sent any letters I wouldn't have received them.Did it show as cancelled? , And Premium Credit aren't the insurers I know 100% I changed my address over the phone on the same day as taking out my new policy for the new car. So Adrian flux are at fault as long as I can be sent a copy of the recording I should be fine. If I request a copy of the phone call do the have to send me it legally? If Adrian Flux have gone down how are you going to ring them? Thank you everyone.

Could you answer the questions, last para post 9 please?

[Milesy123]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

Yes I know premium credit aren't my insurers but they have been given my address from my insurers so I take it adrian flux have the same address. Adrian flux haven't gone bust just one of their underwriters I was told. But I'm not going down that line anyway. If they have my wrong address on their system and I can hold of the recording surely a majestrate can't even go against that one. How can it possibly be my fault I'm not insured if I don't know they have cancelled it.

[des8]

Re: Car impound and speeding ticket help.

It is not a case of whose fault it is.
In law you have a strict liability to be insured.
You (apparently) were not.
Your aim is to escape points on your licence.

Now if your insurer has gone into liquidation, I believe you may have a case against your broker, but that is not a defence against the charge of no insurance.
But even that might be doubtful as it is your wife who is going to receive the fine and endorsement (and that will reflect on subsequent insurance costs.

Have you checked directly with your insurers to see if they have gone into liquidation.
Who are your insurers? The last firm I heard to go bust was Enterprise back in July