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Help with heavy handed and lying baliff, business debt being pursued at home

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  • Help with heavy handed and lying baliff, business debt being pursued at home

    I would love to get a little advice on how to proceed with an unpleasant experience with a baliff yesterday.
    I run a small business that recently left its office space in Islington (30th June). As I spend a lot of time out of the country, our landlord said they would notify the council that we had left and I also e-mailed the council asking for a final statement of what we owed. At this point we had paid the April installment but not the May and June installments.
    Subsequently it transpired that Islington Council had got a court judgement against us for £4000 (for the whole years rates) and an enforcement officer had visited our old office in August to try and enforce this.
    At no time have I actually received any notification that this was happening and to date I still have not seen the court documents.
    I spoke with the enforcement agent on the phone and told him this was all a mistake and that I would sort it out with the Council and that we didn't owe the money. I subsequently paid what I though the outstanding amount was and sent an e-mail to the council to that effect stating clearly that I assumed that I would not need to pay the enforcement fees.
    I had a response from the council say the account had been closed AS PER MY REQUEST (my highlight) and that as I had overpaid I would receive a refund of £21.
    Clearly I assumed that the matter was resolved.
    Yesterday my wife called me to tell me that baliffs were at the door threatening to take our car, my sons' motorbike and my son's friends car that was on my driveway and that we owed them £1200.
    Luckily I was not too far from home so managed to intervene.
    The main issues for me is that the baliff clearly lied to me. I requested a copy of the court document - he declined to show me this but referred me to the notice of entry document he had served us with.
    I told him that a) this was a company debt and why was he trying to enforce this at a residential address that was not the address of the company and b) all these goods anyway did not belong to the company and c) we didn't owe the money anyway as evidenced by the e-mail from the council.
    He told me that the judgement was for my home address (a lie, whilst I have not seen it, it will have been for the company address as they appeared to not know that we had moved out). Unfortunately due to the stress of the situation I didn't press him for the court documents which he was clearly not keen to show me as it would have exposed his lie.
    He rang the council and discovered that we had paid the rates but that the enforcement fee still applied which was £310. The council said he should enforce this (an issue I have taken up with the council).
    He insisted that I prove that the vehicles did not belong to the company which I was able to do for my son's motorbike but our own car is 9 years old and he wasn't happy with the V5 document, the insurance or the orignal HP agreement (paid off some time ago). Also for my son's friends car we obviously had no documents.
    He said pay up or they would clamp all the cars and send for a lorry to take them away immediately and sell them at auction (for an apparent debt of £310, value of vehicles approx.£15,000).
    Knowing that once I had paid I would never see this money again and feeling very angry that this was happening as as far as I was concerned I didn't owe this money I was loath to pay this. The enforcement agent continually accused me of deliberately trying to avoid the enforcement fee by dealing with the Council rather than him, despite the point I made to him that I would be resolving this with the council as I know that these agents will not waive there fees on the say so of the debtor but only from their client.
    I wasn't able to get hold of anyone at the council on the phone (no surprise there) but having paid the £310 as I really didn't want to have property not belonging to me clamped and removed, I subsequently e-mailed the council expressing my anger and suggesting that they reimburse me.
    Credit to the council they immediately sent me an e-mail saying that they would instruct the enforcement agent to refund the money straightaway and asked for my bank details for this to be done. Needless to say this has not been actioned so far and to be honest I suspect ths will take some time to recover.
    On reflection I am now so pissed off about this that I want to make a formal compalint to the council and to the enforcement company (Rundles) about the actions of their agent. (I have most of the altercations on video) and I want to get my money back immediately in the process.
    All these altercations took place outside my house in full view of the neighbours, initially the agents were dealing with my wife and were extremly threatening and forceful with her and upset her a great deal, they then subsequently lied to me and as far as I am concerned, were coming on to my home property with absolutely no authority whatsover to try an enforce a debt that was owed by a company (limited) at a completly diferent address.
    I would really appreciate a view in terms of how far they have abused their position in this situation as whilst the money is relatively small amount, I really do feel that if this sort of behaviour is ignored and not dealt with it will result in these sort of practices continuing and perhaps against people a lot more vunerable and unable to pay than me.
    Many thanks in advance
    Philip
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: Help with heavy handed and lying baliff, business debt being pursued at home

    If the company is limited, you may have good grounds for complaint against Rundles. if you are a sole trader, it may be more difficult. Is there any connection between the home and the company? (registered office/previous trading from there etc)
    Did you receive a notice of enforcement from Rundles?
    Have you got a copy of the email that you sent to the council telling them that you were leaving?
    Did you provide them with a forwarding address for the final bill?

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Help with heavy handed and lying baliff, business debt being pursued at home

      Thanks for the reply, the company is limited and there is no connection between the home and the company in that it has never traded from here or been registered here - I did provide the address to the council for mail forwarding purposes and ironically the company is still based in the same office space in Islington but on a co-working basis rather than actually having an actual office.
      All that has been received from Rundles is intially an Attendance Notice to Take Control of Goods at the company address on 19th of August for £4082. I did speak with the agent at that time and told him that this was a mistake and I would be sorting it out with the Council. On the visit from the enforcement agent yesterday he had another Attendance Notice to Take Control of Goods although this time with my home address on.
      In fairness, my landlord did not let the Council know about our move until late in August and this is the reason that this has got to this stage as I did not contact the Council until I realised what had happened. Below is the e-mail correspondence on which I assumed all had been resolved: I still have never seen any judgment details and have never recieved any warning of this action or a potential visit from an enforcement agent despite having a Post Office redirect on our mail.


      Dear Mr XXXXXX

      Thank you for your email.

      My records show that the account has been closed as requested.
      The overpayment £21.32 will be refunded by cheque shortly.

      Yours sincerely,

      XXXXXXXXX
      Revenues Officer
      Finance Department
      Islington Council
      PO Box 34750
      7 Newington Barrow Way
      London N7 9EY
      www.islington.gov.uk
      Follow us on Twitter@IslingtonBC and @IslingtonLife

      Want to pay online or by direct debit?
      Please visit: www.islington.gov.uk/payit

      If you are interested in applying for Council Tax Support you can telephone the Benefits Service on 020 7527 4990 or e-mail benefits.service@islington.gov.uk
      From: XXXXXXX

      Sent: 22 August 2016 14:29
      To: Rates, Business
      Subject: XXXXXXXXX



      Dear Janice



      I'm just getting in touch as there seems to have been some miscommunication regarding our tenancy at the address refereed to below.



      We vacated this property on 30th June 2016 and were told by the landlord that they would notify you that we had left. We were then expecting a final bill from you so that we could pay the balance.



      It now appears that this has not happened and an enforcement agent came to the property recently to collect the full year of rates that is not due. We have now been notified of this and have therefore, for the sake of expediency, paid what we think the final balance is (£784) without being in receipt of the final bill.



      Could you therefore please e-mail if possible this final bill for our accounting records and to ensure that it is correct. We are also anticipating that we will not need to pay the enforcement agency fees either.



      Many thanks for your help



      Kind regards

      XXXXXX

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Help with heavy handed and lying baliff, business debt being pursued at home

        Excellent.

        A formal complaint is the way forward. The points to raise are:

        1. The council failed to act after being given notice of leaving and a forwarding address for the final bill (evidence attached)
        2. No notice of enforcement was ever received by the company, regarding the debt. Therefore, all enforcement thereafter was invalid.
        3. The enforcement agent had no authority to visit the private home of people who are not the debtor. This is far greater than just a simple breach of legislation.
        4. If, for point of argument, the enforcement agent was entitled to visit your private residence, he was under a duty to leave as soon as he had satisfied himself that there were no goods of the debtor at the premises. If he wasn't a trespasser at the start of the visit, he certainly was from the point at which he was aware that no goods of the debtor were at the premises.
        5. Instead of leaving, the enforcement agent remained and extorted money by threatening to remove items belonging to you, your son and your son's friend, despite being shown evidence of ownership.

        Ask that you be refunded the £310 as enforcement should never have taken place at that property. Also question as to why a liability order was obtained if the council had been made aware of a forwarding address for billing.

        Add anything else of your own that you feel is relevant.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Help with heavy handed and lying baliff, business debt being pursued at home

          Thanks so much, will get on this straight away, appreciate your help!

          Comment

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