Dad's signature on Will (well, possibly) but not his name above the signature

[Sessie]

Re: Dad's signature on Will (well, possibly) but not his name above the signature

Just take out the 'brother' bit.

ie My brother and I had a drink - remove 'my brother and' - I had a drink - (correct)

A package came for my brother and I - A package came for I (incorrect - unless you are a Rasta, like Bob Marley, RIP!)

Dear God, how on earth did you get a brain like that? I was only issued with a small one - why wasnt I given one as big as yours? Can I upgrade? Tis not fair - the most I know is Newtons Laws of Motion and I only know the first 2 because when I wrote all 3 on my legs for my exams (many moons ago ......... OLevels :o( ) ... I couldnt get to copy Law 3 as it was too high up :doh:

[charitynjw]

Re: Dad's signature on Will (well, possibly) but not his name above the signature

So fa(r), so good?

(Coat?)

erm........

[des8]

Re: Dad's signature on Will (well, possibly) but not his name above the signature

[QUOTE=Sessie;638600] (oh noooo, Des and Welshman will be after me for that ,,,,,,,,,,,, :bolt:

Take more than that to get us chopsing.

[Openlaw15]

Re: Dad's signature on Will (well, possibly) but not his name above the signature

Hi All

This isnt of any urgency - as god knows (and so do the Beagles, I need one case out of the way before doing another :fencing


This is just a query, not urgent, on behalf of me and my brother (or is it my brother and I ?)

Ok, we didn't pounce on this when we spotted it years ago as to be honest we'd been through a lot grieving and we were both at odds as to look into it or not - I've always wanted to, brother didnt but now he does. It's not urgent so I dont want the Beagles putting themselves out for us, its more a 'could you cast your eyes over and see what your view/s are'.

I'll give you a quick run down of events and I'll post the Will on here tomorrow as you'll obviously need it before commenting. I cant post it now as I'm in bed, it's 1am, the Will is someone in a drawer downstairs and I've just spilled a yogurt all over me :duh:

Ok, Dad lovely man - married twice - our mother / then stepmonster
Children - my brother and myself by our mum / two half breeds by stepmonster (I know not politically correct but they are money grabbing horrid lazy lazy horrid horrid beasts as they are their mother's children - rant over)
Dad - worked hard all his life, never missed a days work, medical notes completely empty - self employed body panel beater
Stepmonster - (pointless to this post but think he married her on rebound) - attractive, 12 years younger - never worked A DAY in her life - apparent back issue - claimed ALL her life - back problems never an issue when she's out and about on holiday though
9-10 years ago (I know this is why it's not urgent - just seeing what you think) - Dad diagnosed with Motor Neurone Disease - fast progressive - died within 15 mths of diagnosis - never seen the world he wanted to see

* Note relevant to post but to give you an idea of stepmonster - late 80s before wedding businesses were common, Dad started one, basically a consierge (incorrect spelling) to every part of the wedding minus the dress/s. Business was a weekend thing, was hugely successful, my poor father didnt know what success was, he was doing 2-3 weddings a saturday and it was enough for him to leave that stinking fumy damp garage that was killing him - he hated it. However, stepmonster - as monsterous as she is/was/still is was very good at flower arranging, but in order for him to move forward and leave his business in garage which he was desperate to do, she would have to give up her sickness benefits - trust me this woman is genuinely not sick, her FB pictures say it all - alas the monster would not give her benefits up. Take into considersation this was late 80's, he'd earn more these days, but even back then he was bringing in over a grand per wedding with very little outlay - Dad was a genius at everything he touched, but he wasnt a businessman, so when he found this, it was like he finally had made it in life. He wasnt a 'money person' money didnt matter, I'm not like it, neither is brother, we prefer to be happy and content as long as bills are paid and food on table - that's fine. But he did want to travel, he never got too. Without the flowers, which played a big part, he couldnt run it, he tried but it didnt work and she wouldnt allow him to get someone else in. Business ended and she watched my Dad go back to working 6am until 1130-12midnight around a damp garage every single day, no weekends off, nothing. Garage was an old poky thing, Dad was a perfectionist with a great reputation but business was hard. He hated it.

Moving on 10 years or so - Motor Neurone diagnosed. Dad had apparently made a Will. I wont go into this part now as it's not relevant, but some years before stepmonster made a rift between us and I was estrangled from my Dad. However, my brother worked with Dad around that garage since a child,, not just father and son, but the very very best of friends. Dad was a very honest person, no I dont like that he allowed her to shut me out but lets leave that there, he'd died and I wont get answers. However, my brother was part of Dad's every day life. Now here's what I do not have proof of:

No-one told me my Dad was dying, I found out off a stranger by accident. I got to hospital and Dad was already bed ridden and no voice, he was on a voice machine. Told me he loved me through the machine, I'm not too good with that sort of thing and regrettably I couldnt say it back, some of us arent built like it, wish I was different but life gives your lemons and all that ... that however did not take away how much I was broken up, I just dont show emotion outright. So he loved me, I know 100% he loved my brother. Stepmonster, spoke to me decently during hospital visits, but she's not to be trusted so I kept my guard up. She told me and my partner, both her and my dad had made Wills at same time. However, she said just before dad became bed bound (from diagnosis to death 15mths so it was within this time) she said they had visited the solicitors to have 'my brother' excluded out of Dad's Will. No reason just said that. I presume I was never in it ........ who cares, I wouldnt have contested it at time as I firmly believe if someone doesnt want to leave you anything you shouldnt fight it. So a 2nd Will had been made, excluding brother. Ok, brother has no claim also and Dad had nothing except ........... those garages and house which my grandad had bought for him, and after grandad died, nan left dad the house.

Dad passed.
Stepmonster went from decent to revealing her true colours - money grabbing *&)(^)"&!)(£ of a (*"&!*
I had a phonecall a few days after the funeral from my distressed brother saying he was at the garages, all the locks had been changed. Stepmonster had arrived at scene and told brother garages were now her's and her children's and he was not allowed on premises. My brother had worked with my father and needed his equipment, but she refused him and called Police. Police apparently although had to ask my brother to leave, were very kind to him. I advised my brother on phone to leave and go home.

I then contacted stepmonster through a solicitor requesting a copy of the Will - reason for this was solely about the garages. Please note: I was fully aware that I would not see my name on Will, it didnt matter, but it was not ringing true that my Dad would exclude my brother, they were beyond a father son relationship, it just wasnt adding up. Grandad has bought garages for Dad and Dad always said garages were to go to my brother...............yes I know, heresay is nothing

So, stepmonster rings me screaming, demanding that I and my partner go to house to view Will. I refused, I kept very calm and said, I just wanted a copy, but if she wont provide it then not to worry. She kept screaming that my Dad hated both me and my brother, I still kept calm. In fact she screamed a lot, I still kept calm and still refused to attend house. It was a very odd reaction, just for a request for a Will.

Next few days the Will arrives. It looked typical of what my Dad would have done in the 80s / early 90s, every ornate and a home one, not a professional one. It lays out his name and address as you will see when I post it up tomorrrow, and that everything he has, which wasnt anything, was to go to my stepmonster, then after her the two halfbreeds. No mention of my brother. So ok, what could we do. I knew I wouldnt be in it, and my brother was grieving so much, plus we're not money grabbers, we werent going to contest it. However, we were pretty stupid because it wasnt until a good while later that we noticed on the back of the Will, where it says:

the above named signed: (dad's signature here) .............. the above bit wasnt dad's name at all - as I havent posted Will up, Ill jot down and example below:

Printed name here (of my Dad): Rock Hudson (but Dad's name wasnt rock hudson, it was John Wayne)
Last Will & Testament of the above named (signature here) which looks similar to Dad's (John Wayne)

The person's name in the space where Dad's should be is totally unknown to us.
Also the two witnesses below Dad's signature (in the presence of is of the solicitor (fine)
and
The solicitor's then secretary (also fine) ........... but, the secretary is my stepmonster's neice (in fact, this diverts again a little, she actually may not be her niece, she maybe stepmonster's daughter, we think there was a family cover up before dad married her but nonetheless, not relevant to case but trying to say there's a bond there)

* So, not Dad's name above his signature - is this Will real?
* We know we cant contest it as it's gone too long but we know if something fradulent has happened we can report it
* Is a close relative allowed to be a witness on the Will

Also, stepmonster was Executor of Will. She gained in sale of our grandparents house 150k and the sale of the garages 30k
Dad did not have a penny all the time he was alive, except when doing those weddings, when that ended, although not a debtor, he was a hard working man who had nothing to show for it. He was so poor that my brother often loaned him money so stepmonster didnt know

The Will went through Probate (I am far from au fait with all this stuff) and she didnt sell houses or garages immediately after Dad's death. But my brother knows but cant prove it himself that she carried on trading in the car business in my Dad's name after he passed (buying and selling cars), we dont know how to go about proving this

A week after Dad passed - she went on a cruise with her sister and said niece, to egypt etc
Came back for 2 weeks and went away again on another cruise to africa again with sister and said niece

All of a sudden there was lots of money - this was before house sold, garages sold, Will exectuted

And to top it off, we then find out my Dad's best friend was her new BF, he'd been 'visiting' her while my Dad was in hospital to 'help her through her difficult time'

Dad died in the October, she'd been on 2 cruises, started dating his so called best friend (well, I think they were in flagrante delicto while dad was alive to be honest ......... geez, I can spell that but not 'concierge':tinysmile_grin_t:
And, we looked on her FB (Im not part of FB so someone showed me as I dont know how it all works) and she had house parties, drinking, dancing, and loads of people there, in the house my Dad was left, knocked down and rebuilt every brick himself, with no help from anyone. This woman has never ever ever worked, ever, not only Dad, but a number of people have left her money, large amounts in their Will's, she befriends them, they die, she gets money :noidea::suspicious::spy: ........... I've always worked and the most I can afford after 10years of hope is a new sofa (it's green, it's gorgeous, its a bespoke chesterfield and I'm so excited, but I wont let anyone sit on it, not a single ass has been plonked on it, visitors have to sit on stools in the kitchen :tung: ..... ok, sorry, back on topic) ................. Also on FB are all the holidays she's been on since Dad passed - Note: Dad went to Lanzarote (cant spell that either) when they met in the 80s, that's it, he never seen outside his home town and it depressed him, he was a born traveller like me, he wanted to see the world

1. We cant contest the Will it's too far gone
2. We wouldn't even if we were within that time because we're not greedy people and truly believe Will's shouldnt be contested of a person doesnt want to give you anything (note: unless there is good reason in some cases to contest of course, so I'm not condemning people who have had to do this by no means)
3. We only want to see what experts think, as it seems this woman now, who still claims benefits (I mean such a bad back, oh so bad) has seen more of the world than me, my Dad and brother and probably most people on here
4. We want justice to be done for our father 'if' something fraudulent has taken place, but with the exception of the Will looking not right, we dont know where to start digging, my brother is 100% she carried on trading after Dad passed, but he cant prove it paperwork wise so we dont know where to start there
5. She keeps getting reported to the DWP - nothing happens - we know she hides her money somewhere, she's cunning
6. Even though she probably did keep trading, it still wouldnt have brought in the money she had coming in after Dad's death
7. I know people are going to mention insurance, I know, and my brother too, NOTHING about insurance - Dad had no money, if a big payout happens, wouldnt he have had to pay a lot in?
8. She's living now in a huge huge house, a life of luxury, beyond amount of holidays abroad with my dad's best friend ....... ps, also a claimant

NOTE: THIS IS NOT URGENT - BUT if any Beagles are scanning these pages one night and come across my long boring post - if anything stands out, of anything I've mentioned, I'd be so grateful if you could let me know - I'll post Will on here tomorrow

Ok - this yogurt I tipped all over myself has solidified - it's disgusting - it's 2-30pm and I'm a yogurt covered insomniac that needs to go and wash - Good night Beagles and thanks for anything you can help with (again) ....... not for me, I dont want anything financial from this, no thank you ............ but if my Dad wished my brother to gain or my Dad has been done and injustice - it's for them not me ......... I'm happy with my new sofa !!!!! :cheer2: x

Hello Sessie

Update:

If the Will was fraudulently made i don't think 10 years would bar any claims, but the claims are now in damages. If they're not worth suing you can go after what they own/ possess. The facts are the step-monster lives a luxury lifestyle and lives in a big house, so probably worth suing. You could also go after what she owns, ie the house as there was likely fraud. I am not saying it's going to be cheap. Or you can just do nothing and let her get away with it. It just takes a call to a solicitor preferably a good barrister. If there was coercion (ie even a subtle influence over time and for a quiet life the very sick man/ testator gives in to the pressure) by the 'step-monster' to favour the 'step-monster'...it may well give rise to an investigation by the court too, even after 10 years' passage from when the Will was made should not bar claims. It is fraud no matter what, ie a lie for a substantial gain when the Will was sent to probate. If it were a crime and in my view it is, then the police can take action against the step-monster/ mother in law, even now in view of a prosecution. The criminal courts also have power to issue orders for compensation too.

Unless we see a copy of the Will's terms, any signatures etc.. it's pretty much pointless to comment. Wills' law is generally 1) person must have capacity (ie legally know their own mind), 2), must be in writing with deceased's (testator) signature and witnesses' signatures. There are exceptions, an abbreviated signing such as 'initials may suffice.'