Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

[Openlaw15]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

The CPR 31.14 request is uneccessary at this stage as it is already past judgment so don't worry about that.

The order from the court about the final charging order hearing on application will be heard on the 25th January 2016 should contain a claim reference on it which relates to the original claim ?

If not give the court a call and ask them - which court is it in? Northampton CCBC ? also ask them how to have it transferred to a court nearer you.

Actually it might really help, as things sound a bit confused, if you could take a photo of the letter from the court and from the LR and upload them (TAKE OFF PERSONAL INFO) or email them to me at admin@legalbeagles.info

We should aim to get a witness statement sorted and in by the 11th Jan ( 14 days before the hearing ) so need to know exactly where things are at and then make a decision.

Forget the pre-nup etc type bits for now - you aren't going to lose your home so long as you deal with this CCJ and Charging order properly now.

Amethyst, so you're saying the facts are that there is an interim charging order on the property now? It's a shame the joint tenancy argument in property law wasn't used before then. HMM

[Amethyst]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

There is an interim charging order over the property yes, this is put in place when an application for a charging order is made ( in case you try sell up between application and hearing ).

The Joint tenancy arguments come in at this stage.

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

I am still trying to understand what you say so I can only answer a bit at a time. The lady in question was sent a letter almost identical to mine, I hadn't even noticed until you asked if she was served. Her letter is identical to the end of the second paragraph.
we also enclose copy n79 form dated the 26/11/2015filed with the court with the claimants application.
then it differs from mine in that the last paragraph. :----- If you are a creditor and unable to locate your account do not return this correspondence to us

- - - Updated - - -

Yes it is Northampton CCBC Sorry I am taking so long but its a lot to try and take in I have to keep re-reading your posts

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

If it is useful for me to send the document untouched I would do that but I would point out they have all our details and that isn't for posting.

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

page one land registry

Official copy of register of title
Land Registry


Title number 444444 Edition date 20.02.2006
- This official copy shows the entries on the register of title on 25 NOV 2015 at 08:58:14.
- This date must be quoted as the "search from date" in any official search application based on this copy.
- The date at the beginning of an entry is the date on which the entry was made in the register.
- Issued on 25 Nov 2015.
- Under s.67 of the Land Registration Act 2002, this copy is admissible in evidence to the same extent as the original.
- This title is dealt with by Land Registry, Fylde Office
A: Property Register
This register describes the land and estate comprised in the title.
City: town
1 (23.08.1983) The Freehold land shown edged with red on the plan of the above Title filed at the Registry and being This is the address-,
--------- (------).
2 The Conveyance dated 29 September 1905 referred to in the Charges Register contains the following provision:-
PROVIDED ALWAYS AND IT IS HEREBY AGREED that it shall be lawful for the Vendors their heirs and assigns at any time or from time to time
hereafter to erect buildings on their adjacent lands to any height in
their descretion notwithstanding that an obstruction of light or air may be caused thereby to the said land thereby conveyed or any
buildings for the time being thereupon.
3 The Conveyance dated 1 November 1981 referred to in the Charges Register contains a provision as to boundary structures.
B: Proprietorship Register
This register specifies the class of title and identifies the owner. It contains any entries that affect the right of disposal.
Title absolute
1 (23.08.1983) PROPRIETOR: My name and My Partners name
of The address again
C: Charges Register
This register contains any charges and other matters that affect the land.
1 A Conveyance of the land in this title and other land dated 29
September 1905 made between (1) Francis Mather and Others (Vendors) and (2) Tom Smith (Purchaser) contains covenants details of which are
set out in the schedule of restrictive covenants hereto.
2 The land in this title is subject to a perpetual yearly rentcharge of
1 Of 2

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

there is a claim number on the application for the charging order on land or property

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

My scans are a lot cleaner now. I scan into ocr direct into word then edit and save. then export to pdf, copy and paste so it takes a bit of time but I think the last page is much clearer

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

Title number 33333333333 C: Charges Register continued
£4 created by a Conveyance dated 1 November 1951 made between (1) Ben xxxxx (2) Elizabeth xxxxx and (3) Albert xxxxxxx.
The said Deed also contains covenants.
NOTE: Abstract filed.
Schedule of restrictive covenants
1 The following are details of the covenants contained in the Conveyance
dated 29 September 1905 referred to in the Charges Register:-
AND the Purchaser hereby covenants with the Vendors their heirs and assigns in manner following that is to say THAT the Purchaser his heirs and assigns will at all times hereafter pay to the Vendors and their heirs and assigns the said yearly rentcharge at the times hereinbefore appointed for payment thereof free from all decuctions (except property tax) AND ALSO will for ever hereafter maintain and keep the messuages or dwel1mghouses and buildings erected upon the said plot of land hereby conveyed in good and substantial repair and condition so long as the same will stand and when necessary will rebuild the same or building or other substantial messuages or buildings in lieu thereof of brick or stone or both set in lime mortar with oak or fir timber and covered with good slates and so toties quoties so that there shall always be substantial messuages or dwellinghouses and buildings on the said land of at least the clear yearly letting value of treble the amount of the said yearly rentcharge hereby limited AND ALSO shall and will leave open and unbuilt upon the space of one half in breadth the whole length of the said land facing The Address and ------------ respecitvely and the space of one half in breadth the whole length of the said land abutting on the passage all shewn in the said plan so as to form part of the Road Avenue and passage and will (if not already done) within a reasonable time make form flag pave channel curb drain and sewer the said one half in breadth of ----------------- and the said passage shewn on the said plan AND shall not erect upon the said land any buildings or building for manufacture purposes nor use any building thereon for the purpose of the sale of beer or wine or alcoholic liquor to be consumed on or off the premises nor shall at any time carry on or permit to be carried on upon the said premises any trade or business which may be or become a nuisance or annoyance to the neighbourhood AND ALSO that no buildings shall be erected or used on the said land otherwise than as dwellinghouses and will not erect on the said land any messuages or dwel1inghouse of less value to be let to a tenant than eight shillings per week and will not alter any messuage or dwellinghouse already erected or hereafter to be erected as to be of less weekly value than as aforesaid And also that no buildings on the said land shall project towards any street or road beyond the spae occupied by the existing buildings AND ALSO will at all times insure and keep insured against loss or damage by fire the building or buildings and premises erected upon the said land in some good Insurance Office to be approved by the Vendors their heirs and assigns in a sum sufficient for the rebuilding thereof and will on demand produce to the Vendors their heirs and assigns the policy or policies of such insurance and the receipt or receipts for the premium payable in respect thereof for the current year AND will whenever any loss or damage by fire shall happen to the said building or buildings and premises or any part thereof forthwith expend the money received under such Insurance as a aforesaid with such other moneys as may be necessary for the purpose of rebuilding or reinstating the same.
End of register

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that is both pages of the land registry

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

Now my question to you is what was the reason for the joint tenancy initially '30 years ago.' I now refer you to your first post:

Yes. It was always my intention to protect my family. she was still a teenager really and didn't have a job as such. But it was to me the right thing to do. So I insisted she was entered on the deeds and we made our agreement. I never claimed, wanted or tried to do anything that might threaten the home.

[Openlaw15]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

There is an interim charging order over the property yes, this is put in place when an application for a charging order is made ( in case you try sell up between application and hearing ).

The Joint tenancy arguments come in at this stage.

Thank you for knowledge of procedure Amethyst.

[Openlaw15]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

Now my question to you is what was the reason for the joint tenancy initially '30 years ago.' I now refer you to your first post:

Yes. It was always my intention to protect my family. she was still a teenager really and didn't have a job as such. But it was to me the right thing to do. So I insisted she was entered on the deeds and we made our agreement. I never claimed, wanted or tried to do anything that might threaten the home.

Do you have the reason for the joint tenancy on the property deeds? If so this is your evidence for your defence against a finalised Charge Order.

"A
: Property Register
This register describes the land and estate comprised in the title.
City: town

1 (23.08.1983) The Freehold land shown edged with red on the plan of the above Title filed at the Registry and being This is the address.."

Property details as above. The property is a 1901 freehold (absolute ownership) in land, originally built in 1901.

"B: Proprietorship Register
This register specifies the class of title and identifies the owner. It contains any entries that affect the right of disposal.
Title absolute
1 (23.08.1983) PROPRIETOR: My name and My Partners name"

A joint tenancy has to be made at the same time (four unities) and may only be transferred to those of adult age and have legal capacity (ie sound mind). You say she was a teenager? How old exactly as minors cannot have a joint tenancy they may only have a tenancy in common? The law going back to 1983 going on the land registration's proprietary date of 23 August 1983 would be the Law of Property Act 1925. Was the teenager a minor (ie not adult age/ not sui juris) at the time property transferred to you and her? The fact it was made by deed (as you tell me) indicates the teenager was of legal age (sui juris); this is why I need concrete information (ie specifics ..teenager tells me not too much). When we're discussing land leaving out details creates problems.

From what you have stated to me and from the evidence above but without information from the deed, it appears to be a joint ownership on the land registry. However am not certain if this proves a joint tenancy or tenancy in common. You refer to her as only a teenager so am assuming you were at least early twenties at the time of the property transfer? Assuming the teenager was of age etc it would likely have been a joint tenancy given the property would be left to her automatically (survivor rules) and later the offspring (successor in title).

NB: when you reply click "reply with quote" otherwise we may not know when you have responded.

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

I cant seem to make it into a quote at the moment. I don't know how. But I have looked at the dates on the registry and going off the dates when we bought it she was older. 23 so she wasn't a teen. Sorry about that.

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

From what you have stated to me and from the evidence above but without information from the deed, it appears to be a joint ownership on the land registry. However am not certain if this proves a joint tenancy or tenancy in common. You refer to her as only a teenager so am assuming you were at least early twenties at the time of the property transfer? Assuming the teenager was of age etc it would likely have been a joint tenancy given the property would be left to her automatically (survivor rules) and later the offspring (successor in title).

NB: when you reply click "reply with quote" otherwise we may not know when you have responded.[/QUOTE]

is this right as in a reply with a quote

[Openlaw15]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

I cant seem to make it into a quote at the moment. I don't know how. But I have looked at the dates on the registry and going off the dates when we bought it she was older. 23 so she wasn't a teen. Sorry about that.

So she's about 56 now, and you're perhaps in your 60s? So, your other line of defence is that you're an aged couple and would be worse off than a younger couple

[James Last]

Re: Fraudulent misrepresentation and Prenuptial agreement

on the registry copy it says that
Title absolute
1 (23.08.1983) PROPRIETOR: My name and My Partners name