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Thread: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[2013]

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  1. #1
    Celestine's Avatar

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    Default Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[2013]

    http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2013/882.html

    Following the brilliant result in Roberts v Bank of Scotland PLC [2013] EWCA Civ 882

    Ms Roberts brought a county court claim for harassment following 6 months of telephone calls at a rate of approx 3 per day.
    She won
    the Bank then appealed and lost badly Giving all consumers a nice Court of Appeal binding precedent of £7500 damages for the level of harassment she experienced.

    This result is HIGHLY significant to anyone receiving intrusive levels of phone harassment for debts. Basically, once you tell them you don't want the calls, they can only resort to legal proceedings to 'encourage' payment. Telephoning you night and day is simply NOT acceptable.

    IF YOU ARE RECEIVING SUCH CALLS, PT2537 and I have put together the following template letter to send:

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________

    Dear Sirs DATE
    I am writing to place you on notice that your company is causing me alarm and distress due to the frequency of the telephone calls which I am receiving in relation to Acc: XXXXXXXX
    Whenever the telephone rings, I am left feeling anxious and ill at the prospect of speaking again with your company as I have already repeatedly explained that I am unable to pay any/more money per month towards this account.Please be clear that these calls are far beyond a simple irritation or an unwanted interference, they fall clearly within the definition of Harassment.
    I have made it clear to your company that I do not have the funds to pay you what you are asking. I have asked for these calls to cease however I have been told by your staff that they will continue to telephone me even though I have made it clear that I do not wish to discuss this matter further via the telephone.
    I have received calls from …………………… On the following dates:
    1)
    2)
    3)
    (cont’d overleaf if required)
    I require you to ensure that the recordings of these calls are secured and protected and above all must not be deleted, erased or tampered with as they will be key evidence in a claim which I am preparing to bring against your company. Destruction of these records may lead to contempt of court proceedings being brought against you.
    I require these calls to cease with immediate effect; I will not discuss this matter with your company by telephone. I draw your attention to the Court of Appeal ruling in Roberts v Bank of Scotland PLC (Rev1) [2013] EWCA Civ 882 and in particular paragraph 37 & 38 of the Judgment. The court made it clear that the existence of a debt does not allow a creditor to persist in harassing the debtor.
    I require you to confirm by return that you have secured and protected the recordings of the calls detailed above, I also require you to confirm that these calls will cease with immediate effect. Relevant numbers to remove from your system are listed below:
    If you persist in telephoning me, I will issue an application for an injunction under The Protection from Harassment Act 1997 and I shall also seek damages for the same on the principles laid down in Roberts v Bank of Scotland [2013].
    I trust you will treat this as a matter of extreme urgency.
    Yours sincerely XXXXXX
    LIST OF NUMBERS NUMBERS AFFECTED:
    "Although scalar fields are Lorentz scalars, they may transform nontrivially under other symmetries, such as flavour or isospin. For example, the pion is invariant under the restricted Lorentz group, but is an isospin triplet (meaning it transforms like a three component vector under the SU(2) isospin symmetry). Furthermore, it picks up a negative phase under parity inversion, so it transforms nontrivially under the full Lorentz group; such particles are called pseudoscalar rather than scalar. Most mesons are pseudoscalar particles." (finally explained to a captivated Celestine by Professor Brian Cox on Wednesday 27th June 2012 )

    I am proud to have co-founded LegalBeagles in 2007

  2. #2
    TUTTSI's Avatar

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    Just my thoughts......Sometimes these debt collection agencies do not have the original deed of assignment or the proof of the original loan documentation to be able to take the matter to court so letter may have to be adjusted as the debt may not be due as in a lot of the cases we have seen lately with Lowells and others. But a great case for harassment claims againts the debt collectors.

  3. #3
    labman's Avatar

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    I like the template!

    I was just thinking along the same lines myself Tutts. The thing is, how much of a gamble is it if debtors take action using this case law? Are they going to open themselves up to costs?

    I don't want to be negative, as I've often suggested the use of the letter myself, however, I'd never really thought through that aspect before. :beagle:

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    How would this ruling effect previous harassment by cc company's banks ect?
    now its been brought to light and someone has won in court, what about harassment that happened a year or two ago and the accounts now been sold on?

    id love to bring MBNA to the floor, the amount of calls I received from them drove me potty, then I had Freiderickson and Bryan carter on my case for the same accounts, really made my life hell at a vulnerable period in my life.

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    Celestine's Avatar

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    We think that a letter template similar to the one above would need to be sent DURING the harassment so that there is a formal record that you asked for the harassment to stop.
    "Although scalar fields are Lorentz scalars, they may transform nontrivially under other symmetries, such as flavour or isospin. For example, the pion is invariant under the restricted Lorentz group, but is an isospin triplet (meaning it transforms like a three component vector under the SU(2) isospin symmetry). Furthermore, it picks up a negative phase under parity inversion, so it transforms nontrivially under the full Lorentz group; such particles are called pseudoscalar rather than scalar. Most mesons are pseudoscalar particles." (finally explained to a captivated Celestine by Professor Brian Cox on Wednesday 27th June 2012 )

    I am proud to have co-founded LegalBeagles in 2007

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    What about if I have all my SAR info and it states I asked for all communication to be via my email address only and they MBNA continued to make calls?

    i was messaging them via my online facility and received replies to my emails saying we need to speak to you call this number blah blah..

    i offered them more than I could afford but they refused and continued calling, I can see there calls on my paperwork, lol home, mobile, work phone... One after the other, pain in the you know what at the time.

  7. #7
    labman's Avatar

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    How many calls were there - sufficient to constitute harrassment?

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    Hi lab man,
    they were calling my home phone then mobile then work phone in that order 3 or 4 times a day, made our life's hell to be honest, I asked them to communicate via email or in writing but they never did.

    They knew I had no income coming in at the time and offered them money from our old savings.
    I asked them to freeze interest and charges but they refused and uped my interest rate to 34%.
    i can't do anything now regarding courts and I'm not after compensation but if there some financial body that can wrap there fcking knuckles then let me know, excuse my language but I hate MBNA with a passion

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    Celestine:

    Could this apply to TV Licensing? They are in the habit of sending menacing letters on a regular basis (at least once a month with no time limit), to those who do not have, and have no need of, a TV licence.

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    Quote Originally Posted by enquirer View Post
    Celestine:

    Could this apply to TV Licensing? They are in the habit of sending menacing letters on a regular basis (at least once a month with no time limit), to those who do not have, and have no need of, a TV licence.
    No reason why not, in Ferguson v British Gas the Court of Appeal did take the view that letters were equally as bad as calls, so theres no reason why it couldn't.

    The only issue is if they have a statutory duty to send you something, then they would not really be open to challenge under the PFHA 1997 IMHO

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    it is very important that you keep your own recordings.

    the companies have their own system of removing call records.

    when the crunch comes its your word against theirs and if they havn't given you accurate call logs, there will be no proof of harassment.

    have recordings of you repeatedly asking them to stop the calls.
    keep recordings of silent calls
    or calls when they hang up on you after a few words.
    these will be important and can fall into the titile of malicious calls, which take the harassment into criminal activity.

    above all, dont expect them to be transparent or honest.

    protect your own data and keep your own records.

    although data requests are advisable, dont rely on the DPA too much for help as this is bieng massivly abused by companies to protect them and not us, in any case, I believe that the most they would get is a recommendation to change their ways, no fines, nothing.

    compared to the FOIA it has no teeth and these companies know it.

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

    Quote Originally Posted by solarnewt View Post
    it is very important that you keep your own recordings.

    the companies have their own system of removing call records.

    when the crunch comes its your word against theirs and if they havn't given you accurate call logs, there will be no proof of harassment.

    have recordings of you repeatedly asking them to stop the calls.
    keep recordings of silent calls
    or calls when they hang up on you after a few words.
    these will be important and can fall into the titile of malicious calls, which take the harassment into criminal activity.

    above all, dont expect them to be transparent or honest.

    protect your own data and keep your own records.

    although data requests are advisable, dont rely on the DPA too much for help as this is bieng massivly abused by companies to protect them and not us, in any case, I believe that the most they would get is a recommendation to change their ways, no fines, nothing.

    compared to the FOIA it has no teeth and these companies know it.
    Indeed, although if you have a debt purchased by a third party and say MBNA were the party calling you, then you could make an application for non party disclosure, that would cause them a headache

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    Default Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

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    Lightbulb Re: Protection from Harassment Act 1997 - Damages - NEW TEMPLATE - Roberts v BoS[201

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