Jacobs

[MissiM]

I have been dealing with the Council Tax Advisors since October, they advised that they would contact my council to put forward my payment offer. On 25th November they emailed to confirm they had contacted my council and that is the last I have heared on the subject, until today! I have come home to a letter from Jacobs saying I have 24 hours to pay up or they will remove my goods whether I am in attendance or not! I haven't spoken to the bailiffs at all as this is what I was advised and now I am terrified they will break in and take my things. I suffer from Fibromyalgia and find things very hard to deal with a lot of the time and I just don't know where to turn? Any help would be appreciated

MissiM

[Shirley Temple]

Re: Jacobs

I'm no expert on this but I'm almost certain the bailiffs cannot brake into a house although I believe they can climb through an open window, keep them closed or open but locked on the latch,commercial properties I believe are different, x

[MissiM]

Re: Jacobs

I live on the 4th floor so no chance of them getting through a window. Just a horrid thought that they are threatening to enter even without me being here. I certainly will not be letting them in myself.

[bizzybob]

Re: Jacobs

Have you informed the council and Jacobs of the illness, and it's chronic nature with palliative care the only option? If not do so providing medical evidence as it may render you vulnerable under the National Standards. If you have a car hide it Jacobs WILL clamp it

They cannot force entry, and the threat to remove goods in your absence will be less applicable as it means they will seize valuables left lying around in a garden or insecure shed. As you live on the 4th floor that would not be an option for them. If they threaten a locksmith at this stage, they cannot force entry as they have not had peaceful entry as in you letting them in for a chat. You won't do that so unless they can get a levy on a car they are a little bit knackered. keep them out and remember they will lie threaten and try to bully you. In reality there is no law that compels you to deal with a bailiff so keep em out and limit the damage.


Who the hell are the "Council Tax Advisors"? it appears they have done you no favours at all.

[MissiM]

Re: Jacobs

Fortunately I don't have a car so there's no worries there. I have thought about informing them of my disability however as I work full time I don't know if this would go against me although I can provide documentation from the Dr as proof of FM & that it does effect my ability to deal with things. I am going to ring the council tomorrow to see if I can make an arrangement with them, and I have also managed to download a form to send to the court requesting a suspension of the Warrent. I am just concerned with how long it will take to get something in place as the bailiffs are going to carry on coming after the debt until I can get something sorted out. Is it true that they will give the debt back to the court if they are not successful?

[bluebottle]

Re: Jacobs

As Bizzybob says, without a valid and lawful levy, Jacobs are stuffed. Their threats amount to misrepresentation of their powers. They and the council need to be reminded of their obligations under the Human Rights Act 1998. This can, sometimes, come as a shock to firms who are under contract to public authorities, as many believe the HRA does not apply to them, only the public authority. Unfortunately, the reality is that the Act deems them part of the public authority they are acting for, whether they like it or not. Don't be surprised if Jacobs dispute this. I'll provide you with the relevant provision should it become necessary to push it in their faces.

As far as your Fibromyalgia (FMS) goes, which type do you have - Post Viral, Trauma-Related or Stress-Related? I have the Post Viral type, but it was caused by the bug that causes gastric and duodenal ulcers which has royally trashed my central nervous system leaving me with widespread nerve damage and muscle wasting.

[MissiM]

Re: Jacobs

I have trauma based as I had a bad fall when I was 16, took me 18 years to be diagnosed. However when I'm stressed the symptoms always worsen and my sleep becomes even worse than normal. I'm not sleeping well at all at the moment with all the worry. As u know CFS is also a big part of FMS so finding it hard to concentrate on everyday things. I don't have a problem with making the payments but I just can't deal with the bailiffs. Just want a resolution ASAP so I can stop worrying. All your comments have made me feel a little more at ease though so thanks guys & will keep you updated.

[bizzybob]

Re: Jacobs

They give the debt back to the council in theory, the Liability Order is a kangaroo procedure that means the council hire a room at the court and the magistrates rubber stamp them en masse. It is not a CRIMINAL warrant it is a Liability Order, you could pay the council direct using their online system, all you can owe Jacobs would then be two visit fees totaling £42.50. Be aware though that the muppets may claim a levy on a car, as you don't own one they are knackered but be aware they may well claim a levy on a random car, they have previous for this, in fact they are very good in taking goods belonging to someone other than the debtor, so if they claim a levy you can challenge easily.

I would definitely send proof of the Fibromyalgia, your post above is indicative that bailiff action by the council would be seriously detrimental to your wellbeing, and they may well be breaching the Health & Safety at Work Act 1974 if they fail to risk assess bailiff enforcement against you. and the fact you are working doesn't diminish a vulnerability, so take up bluebottles offer regarding HRA if it becomes necessary.

[TVJonesClassic]

Re: Jacobs

I am going to ring the council tomorrow to see if I can make an arrangement with them

The council will probably try and fob you off with "it's in the hands of the bailiffs", but you have a right to ask to deal directly with the council at any stage of the process when it relates to council tax. The reference for this is a document,

"Department for Communities and Local Government; Council Tax: Guidance to local councils on good practice in the collection of Council Tax arrears. June 2013."

and the relevant Section is 4.5 which states,

"Local Authorities should remain prepared to deal directly with individuals at any point. It is perfectly within their gift to call action back from the bailiffs at any time, and where there is a case to do so they should consider such action."

It sounds like you should be able to make a case for the council to deal directly with you. If you have had some third party ("council tax advisors"?) acting on your behalf who did or didn't actually contact the council, it shows that you have been trying to contact them.

And, there are rules around vulnerable people. The same document I referred to above says this:

"People in vulnerable situations
4.8 The National Standards for Enforcement Agents gives examples of potentially
vulnerable situations. The reality is that judgements need to be made on a case by
case basis.
4.9 There should be clear, agreed protocols in place between Local Authorities and their
bailiffs governing the approach that should be taken in vulnerable situations and the
kinds of cases which should be raised with, or referred back to, local authorities for
further consideration when encountered."

So if the council are resistant, press them on "a case by case basis" and ask what are their "clear, agreed protocols" to have cases referred back from the bailiffs in the case of people in vulnerable situations. Ask the names and job title of anyone you speak to, write these down, and if you don't get an immediate result ask for their superior.

And as has been said already, don't worry, the bailiffs can't break in, or force their way in. And don't open the door if they visit.

[bizzybob]

Re: Jacobs

As you are 4th floor, is there an entryphone system? If so it will be even harder for them to get in.

[CleverClogs]

Re: Jacobs

As you are 4th floor, is there an entryphone system? If so it will be even harder for them to get in.

Unless they ring a random flat bell and tell the occupant that they have a delivery from Amazon.

[MissiM]

Re: Jacobs

If they do get I via a neighbour can they break my flat door open?

[CleverClogs]

Re: Jacobs

If they do get I via a neighbour can they break my flat door open?

Not legally.

If they do try such tricks, do not open your door to the bugger(s) - not even on the chain - and call the police to get them removed.

[bizzybob]

Re: Jacobs

Not legally.

If they do try such tricks, do not open your door to the bugger(s) - not even on the chain - and call the police to get them removed.

Most definitely, as your flat has a secure front door, and you have exclusive occupation he cannot claim he has had peaceful entry to the building such as to allow him to force your front door as if it was merely an internal door having gained entry to your home. The communal areas and corridors are for the purposes of the law regarding bailiffs entry to premises akin to a street. The bailiff may well claim otherwise, but if he did call and persist, record his threats by filming him with a mobile phone through the letterbox.

You DO NOT have to let the bugger in, unless you want to give him more opportunity to fleece you. Keep him out he can charge £42.50 max.

Jacobs are a cunch of bunts who deserve to be closed down, their speciality is unlawful seizure and sale of third party cars, so don't be surprised when pressed for a fee breakdown they claim a levy on a random car parked outside the block.

[ploddertom]

Re: Jacobs

Have Council Tax Advisers charged you any fees for the work they "claim" to have done on your behalf? They appear to make a lot of claims but in reality do very little.

As for applying to suspend the "Warrant" then I'm afraid this is something you cannot do as that is for something else. As others say deny him access and eventually he will get bored and move on.