can i be fired?

[des8]

Re: can i be fired?

There speaks the copper:doggieyes:

[bluebottle]

Re: can i be fired?

There speaks the copper:doggieyes:

Yes, I know, Des. You don't have to remind me. Lol!

[Inca]

Re: can i be fired?

Has your boss got bosses?
If so she is likely compiling information about the incident to decide what,if any, effect all this has on your colleagues position at the care home.
I would imagine she will be pretty peeved if she only finds out about your differering statements when you are in the witness box and may wonder what else you are hiding.
Trust in employees is paramount in any job but more so in your line of work so if you get caught out in this lie it could have long term ramifications for you so I would bite the bullet and talk to her before she finds out another way.
Bear in mind also that ,in the witness box,you are under oath and you MUST tell the truth...not what version of events suits you or your colleague best because any solicitor/barrister worth their salt will demolish a pack of lies as easily as 1.2.3

Just my opinion of course

[bluebottle]

Re: can i be fired?

Has your boss got bosses?
If so she is likely compiling information about the incident to decide what,if any, effect all this has on your colleagues position at the care home.
I would imagine she will be pretty peeved if she only finds out about your differering statements when you are in the witness box and may wonder what else you are hiding.
Trust in employees is paramount in any job but more so in your line of work so if you get caught out in this lie it could have long term ramifications for you so I would bite the bullet and talk to her before she finds out another way.
Bear in mind also that ,in the witness box,you are under oath and you MUST tell the truth...not what version of events suits you or your colleague best because any solicitor/barrister worth their salt will demolish a pack of lies as easily as 1.2.3

Just my opinion of course

What you say is absolutely true, Inca. I have seen legal professionals tear witnesses to shreds in court and it is not a pleasant experience, either for the witness or those observing the hearing. If anything, the saying, "Act in haste, repent at leisure," seems relevant in this case.

[enquirer]

Re: can i be fired?

Rather than contempt, if the manager starts sticking her oar in, she may suddenly become familiar with the phrase 'perverting the course of justice'.

[Inca]

Re: can i be fired?

I saw a witness/defendant demolished like that in the box...and the so called 'star defence witness DID get done for perverting the course of justice..because her evidence could only be a pack of lies after the 'guilty' verdict.
I don't scare easily but have to say,,I was definitely a tad intimidated by the Judges reaction.

What are OP's sensible (and legal) options here???

[bluebottle]

Re: can i be fired?

Rather than contempt, if the manager starts sticking her oar in, she may suddenly become familiar with the phrase 'perverting the course of justice'.

You're on the ball, Enquirer. Sub judice applies not only to Contempt of Court, as alluded to by Des8, but to Perverting the Course of Justice also. This has been my main concern from the outset. Although the OP's colleague has a duty to inform his boss he has been involved in an altercation that has resulted in him suffering injury and having to appear in court, the boss, really and truly, should not have stuck her oar in without contacting the police first. If she has any sense, she will destroy the statement she obtained from the OP and any copies thereof, and wait until the case has been dealt with by the Crown Court before doing anything else. In some instances, employers and managers can be very helpful in such matters, but in other instances they can be a menace.

[enquirer]

Re: can i be fired?

What are OP's sensible (and legal) options here?

Analysing ...

i was witness to a fight outside of work which involved a collegue. i told the police that i didnt see who hit who first(which is the truth) but i suspected that my collegue was hit first because his teeth had been knocked out.

Told police did not see who hit whom first but thought colleague hit first.

... when my boss asked me to give her a statement i wrote that i saw the other man hit my colleague first.

Told manager that saw other man hit colleague first.

So ... he told police the truth. The court appearance should be fine, unless the manager starts interfering and produces the other statement.

The court may take a dim view of that, although he could defend himself - if appropriate - by pointing out that the manager put him under pressure to say what he did in the statement made to her. This would be credible, particularly as the version of events given to the police is not in the defendants favour.

It all depends on whether or not he thinks that the manager is going to stick her oar in. If he thinks it likely, then it might be wise, as Bluebottle suggests, to speak to the OIC.

[Inca]

Re: can i be fired?

Aaaah,,I get it now.....
So,,basically it hinges on wether the manager decides to produce conflicting statement to the one given to the police.?
Is she being called as a witness??

[enquirer]

Re: can i be fired?

So,,basically it hinges on wether the manager decides to produce conflicting statement to the one given to the police.?

That's his dilemma.

Is she being called as a witness??

She was not present at the original incident, so has nothing to offer in that respect. She might be called if someone gets wind of another statement. The danger is that she will push herself forward.

[bluebottle]

Re: can i be fired?

I saw a witness/defendant demolished like that in the box...and the so called 'star defence witness DID get done for perverting the course of justice..because her evidence could only be a pack of lies after the 'guilty' verdict.
I don't scare easily but have to say,,I was definitely a tad intimidated by the Judges reaction.

What are OP's sensible (and legal) options here???

As you have noticed, Inca, judges do not like anyone making a mockery of the justice system or extracting the bodily waste fluid. I once witnessed a County Court Judge reduce a 6'0" tall barrister to 6" in a matter of seconds after said barrister tried to pull the wool over the judge's eyes. Everyone in the court cringed, including the usher, the clerk of the court, the claimant and the defendant.

[bluebottle]

Re: can i be fired?

Analysing ...


Told police did not see who hit whom first but thought colleague hit first.


Told manager that saw other man hit colleague first.

So ... he told police the truth. The court appearance should be fine, unless the manager starts interfering and produces the other statement.

The court may take a dim view of that, although he could defend himself - if appropriate - by pointing out that the manager put him under pressure to say what he did in the statement made to her. This would be credible, particularly as the version of events given to the police is not in the defendants favour.

It all depends on whether or not he thinks that the manager is going to stick her oar in. If he thinks it likely, then it might be wise, as Bluebottle suggests, to speak to the OIC.

I concur with what you say, Enquirer. The OP needs to speak to the Officer-in-the-Case at the earliest possible opportunity. The O-I-C can then insert the toe of their boot in the boss's rear end if they consider the boss's involvement could prejudice the case in any way, including the OP's colleague's right to a fair hearing.

[ben oseman]

Re: can i be fired?

i am so sorry guys, i read my statement that was given to my employer and i made a mistake, i wrote evrything down tying in with my statemnt i gave to police so panic over there. i also spoke to an officer regarding my boss asking for a staement and he told me its fine as she has to asses if the colleague is safe to work in the care home. so panic over. i was really worried for my job but now the relief was amazing. all i have to worry about now is going to court and all the stress involved in that but as i said before i gave my statement to police to best of my knowledge but remebering everything once in the court room is my issue now lol

[bluebottle]

Re: can i be fired?

i am so sorry guys, i read my statement that was given to my employer and i made a mistake, i wrote evrything down tying in with my statemnt i gave to police so panic over there. i also spoke to an officer regarding my boss asking for a staement and he told me its fine as she has to asses if the colleague is safe to work in the care home. so panic over. i was really worried for my job but now the relief was amazing. all i have to worry about now is going to court and all the stress involved in that but as i said before i gave my statement to police to best of my knowledge but remebering everything once in the court room is my issue now lol

I used to be the secretary of my local Victim Support scheme until it was merged with a larger scheme and I found myself with time on my hands. Victim Support operate (or used to operate) the Witness Service. Contact the Crown Court in question and ask for the contact telephone number of the Witness Service at the court. You can speak to them and discuss any anxieties you may have about giving evidence in the court, especially if it is your first time.

[des8]

Re: can i be fired?

I wonder if Ben will ever revisit this forum.
He came asking if embroidering the truth about a colleague's situation was likely to cost him his job.
What he got IMO was scary stories about sub judice and perverting the course of justice!!
We have no reason to suppose his employer will go to the police with his statement.
If she does he has not (IMO) been guilty of contempt of court because:
1) he has not published anything which causes justice to be substantially impeded (contempt of Court act 1981)
2)he has done nothing to interfere with the administration of justice (common law contempt)
Further he can hardly be guilty of perverting the course of justice, as that requires the offender to
1) actually do something
2)which has a tendency to
3)and is intended to pervert
4)the course of justice

How can a statement which was INTENDED to be private fall within those parameters?

Also, whilst an act designed to pervert the course of justice may also fall foul of sub judice rules, the charge will be the greater i.e. perverting the course of justice

Further I very much doubt if the statement given to the boss is written in the correct form to be used as a witness statement.

Why has this thread moved off subject?

Crossed with op's post above.
Glad it is all over for Ben