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Charge Notification Letters Required

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  • #31
    Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

    Halifax prelim response - June 2007

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    • #32
      Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

      This taken from an Abbey settlement offer. This was just a word document in the attachments folder on my old site, I have no idea who posted it. However, I did a claim for my brother against Abbey and I still have all the paperwork. I'm assuming his settlement letter will have been the same, so I'll dig it out.

      Abbey Offer

      We enclose by way of service a copy of the defence that we have filed with the court.

      The next stage in the process will be for the court to send each of us an allocation questionnaire. In the interim we are writing to you to ascertain whether you would be prepared to agree to a settlement of your claim now in order to bring the matter to a close, limiting further expense to both of us and also avoiding the necessity of taking the further procedural steps such as filling of AQ.

      Regarding the charges, you will see from the defence that Abbey takes issue with your claim on a number of points. For the purpose of this letter though, we should like to mention in particular that your claim seems to be based on the argument that you should not pay any charges at all. It cannot be correct that Abbey cannot charge anything at all if you become overdrawn or do not meet direct debits as Abbey must remedy the issues with the account and this incurs expense. This is in line with the bank industry practice and the T&C under which you opened the account. Even if it were correct (which is not accepted) that the charges are greater than Abbey’s actual loss in dealing with your account, Abbey would still be entitled to charge you something for the expenses. Further, you will see the charges are liquidated damages and not penalty charges and are therefore valid pre-estimates of loss.

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      • #33
        Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

          Hahaha!

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          • #35
            Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

            I got a copy of my brother's settlement letter, but it is different to the one above and just says here's the money now cancel the claim. However, I got the written defence in my hand. No scanner here, will do that tomorrow, but it states:
            "6. The claimant has overdrawn or exceeded overdraft limits on the Account on a number of occasions, full details of which will be provided in disclosure. Therefore by virtue of the conditions referred to in paragraph 3 above such overdrawing was unauthorised and in breach of contract"

            "8. The claimant's contention that the fees are unenforeceable and/or are "penalty charges" is denied. The fees reflect and are proportionate to the Defendant's administrative expenses incurred due to the Claimant's breach of contract and are a genuine pre-estimate of the damage suffered by the Defendant"
            Also dug up a letter he got from Halifax in 2003:
            We have paid the item(s) below which means your account is now overdrawn by more than your overdraft limit.
            To cover our costs, we make a charge of £20 for any item we pay. We take this money from your account two days after you incur the charge...

            Nobody likes paying charges and we'd like to help you avoid them in future...
            I was just thinking, if these historics were to be challenged like this, then the result of the test case that's just been ruled on might actually be a blessing because they have already argued against this for us.
            Also, wasn't Tom Brennan's claim for exemplary damages dismissed because Natwest argued that it involved a breach of contract?
            Last edited by Smasher; 12th December 2009, 19:13:PM.

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            • #36
              Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

              hoping this scan upload is working cos its driving me nuts now!!

              fingers crossed.... CatX
              Last edited by catinahat; 13th December 2009, 08:11:AM.

              Paper clips - the larval stage of coat-hangers!

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              • #37
                Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                No, didn't work I'm afraid. If you can attach the scan to an e-mail let me know and I'll PM you my e-mail address.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                  Hi Exc,

                  Managed to get it attached with email if you can pm yr email addy? Thanks again, CatX

                  Paper clips - the larval stage of coat-hangers!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                    Cat's charges letter

                    Edited by Budgie - Removed remaining personal details
                    Last edited by Budgie; 13th December 2009, 10:33:AM.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                      Thanks Cat ( and Exc for posting ).

                      That letter has a paragraph within which is very useful.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                        Please keep the examples of charge notification letters and responses to preliminary and LBA letters coming.

                        We are really pleased with what we have seen so far but we still need more.

                        We will pull all of these together next week and produce a report with all of the extracted juicy bits.

                        Just a reminder on what we are looking for in these letters.

                        Written evidence to show that the banks, prior to and during the test case were referring to the charges as breaches of contract, default fees, fees to cover their additional costs in dealing with failed transactions etc etc.

                        The target is to try and get copies of letters applicable to each bank and to each set of terms and conditions for each of those banks.

                        This evidence will be fundamental to arguing on the grounds of misreprestation and possibly resurrecting the common law penalty argument, certainly for historic charges.

                        PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE, if you have 10 mins to spare today, look through your files and try and dig out any of these types of letters. Scan them in, remove personal details and post up on here.

                        Thanks to Smasher and Ed for all they are doing behind the scenes on this, thanks for the email's and PM's as well.

                        Budgie

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                        • #42
                          Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                          Abbey defence - March 2007

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                            Halifax unauth overdraft letter - 2003

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                            • #44
                              Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                              Should have a good few more by next week, got some of I've got to go through to see if they are suitable, and a very nice chap is sending me everything he owns from a claim about 3 years ago which I'm hoping will have a lot of very useful stuff in it.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: Charge Notification Letters Required

                                Attached is a NatWest 2001 Business Account bounced cheque notification.

                                As dealing with unpaid cheques means extra administrative work, I have charged a fee of £30 to your account to cover these costs.
                                The charge is also immediate (i.e. no 14 day notification period).

                                Note the Business account T & Cs sent by NatWest in 2002 were identical to those reviewed by Andrew Smith, in particular regarding the use of the NatWest Card. Therefore it is reasonable assume the 2001 business accounts T & Cs were the same of the personal account, especially for the relevant clause that the account holder MUST NOT use a card to go over agreed limits.
                                Therefore the business acount default charges presumably are also capable of being penalties.

                                Comment

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