* discontinued * Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

[GBExile]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Thank you for your reassurance.

If he receives my defence and realises his bullying game isn't working and it looks like it will swing in my favour then does nothing would that be it then?

Thanks again

If he does nothing then its the end but you have already said he is a bit unstable. Dont waste your time trying to predict his next move. If you do let him get to you then he is achieving want he wants.

[GBExile]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Oh. If he doesnt do anything within any deadline set by the court then it might be an idea to write to the court asking for a strike and giving your reason. It might speed things up a bit.

[benken28]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Hi

Would someone please be able to give me a rough guideline on setting out my defence?

Do you number your points such as

1 I was a director with co defendant of company

2 The company ceased trading on and was dissolved by companies house on

3 Mr X was employed by the limited company to carry out said works, we have CIS vouchers issued to him by the company and he was paid directly from the company bank account.

4. I offered no personal guarantee of payment.

5. This is an abuse of the court system.

Thanks

[GBExile]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

3 Mr X quoted for works & was instructed on successful bidding by the limited company to carry out said works,

4 THE company has on file CIS vouchers issued to the claimant by the limited company that state that the claimant was paid by the limited company & the claimants deductions submitted to HMRC, as required by law.

5 The claimant was paid directly from the limited companies bank account to the claimants chosen bank account..

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Just a thought....

Dont use the words "employed" or "employer" & get id of "I offered no personal guarantee of payment." & "This is an abuse of the court system"

Do you know you are really going to annoy a judge with the above & "employed" suggests they are PAYE.

My thoughts are you are struggling to know the difference between running a limited company & running as a sole trader.

If you keep referring to the limited business as you & your partner you are digging yourself a big hole.

The limited company is not you & neither is it your partner. It is an entity in itself directed by you. Hence the word "director".

Sorry. I had to say it & be blunt because no one else has.

[MIKE770]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Example Defence

[benken28]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Thanks for that, so would i say he was instructed by the company to carry out works at ...
I have been told to point out that as he was fully aware he was instructed by the limited company it is an abuse of the court system to try to claim against us in our personal capacity.

Thanks again

[benken28]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Thanks for that, I see this is more for credit card debt. Shall I use it as a template?

Do you think I should keep it brief in that I was a director, company ceased trading now dissolved and the instruction came from the company

Thanks again

[GBExile]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

"abuse of the court system"

good luck with that.

It will not do any favours

Its just to antagonise an unstable person & a judge.

Please keep in mind that your company wasnt wound up & was not liquidated.. It just got struck off because you & your partner decided not to bother filing forms with Companies House & HMRC.

I think its probably best you do not have a personal digs at the claimant. Who your company, that you ran owes/owed a lot of money to & dont forget that.

There are ways of winning things but I will tell you now. If you ever sit in front of a Judge & say that under these circumstances... It will not go well for you.

Stick to the basics. Defend yourself but do not make it personal. You do not have the moral high ground.

You do realise that anyone can resurrect your company? If they chose to do so?

& Do you also realise that directors have a duty to ensure the companies they run also act lawfully which includes the winding up of companies? Which some might argue yours may not have been.

& you do obviously realise (being a director) that you are personally liable should your limited company not behave lawfully.

& If I was the claimant who you owed £4k & you submitted that defence to me I would bury you & you would lose.

The CIS receipts are your weapon. You do not have anything else. Use your tools wisely & do not write a single word that you cannot back up with facts & dont take the mick out of someone you are responsible for owing a lot of money to. Morally or Legally.

I could go on & on & on.

[benken28]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Ok thanks. We behaved lawfully through out and the reason we didn't wind it up is because the company didn't have any money. We ceased trading as is required by law when we were not paid by the 2 clients as we were insolvent.
If the company was reinstated I believe this is an expensive process and as the company doesn't have any assets would be a waste of time and money.
I don't believe I have taken the Mick out of the claimant but I know he is fully aware this is a company debt and he has harassed me and my family and this feels part of that campaign.

[R0b]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

You do realise that anyone can resurrect your company? If they chose to do so?

Actually that's not quite true, only a select list set out in the Companies Act can apply to restore the company to the register.

& you do obviously realise (being a director) that you are personally liable should your limited company not behave lawfully.

Assuming you are talking about piercing the corporate veil then I am afraid that is unlikely to happen in this case as the courts will rarely, if ever, pierce the veil and hold a director personally liable unless it can be proved one of the criteria has been met.

@benken28 you are right that restoring the company to the register is not cheap and it's not generally fast either. You'd usually contact the Registrar of Companies and confirm if they are willing to consent to the restoration, then make the application to the court, etc. The only good reason I can see here to restore the company would be if there were assets that vested in the Crown on dissolution of the company. The Crown would have to pay an equal amount to those assets but as you've confirmed, there were not assets so the claimant would be throwing good money after bad.

Forgive me if I've missed it but have you put the claimant on notice at any time prior to proceedings and/or after they commenced that he shouldn't be persuing you? There's possibly an argument for harassment if the claimant knew that he shouldn't be going after you yet decided to do so anyway, or this could be a counter claim for malicious prosecution of civil proceedings.

When is your defence due? The example defence in the post above is just an example of how it should be set out but the details of your defence will need to change. I don't think you uploaded a copy of the claim form/particulars of claim but that would be useful if you can (personal info redacted). However to give you an idea, you might want to set out your defence along the following lines:

1. Deny the allegations as to the monies owed.
2. Set out the background to all of this e.g. you explain that you are a former director of the company, and the Claimant was (and is if that is the case) a contractor under the Construction Industry Scheme (CIS). He was engaged to quote for works of XYZ of which the company agreed etc.
3. The contract was therefore between the company and the Claimant, not yourself personally.
4. Yo ualso have CIS vouchers confirming that the company paid the claimant which further confirms point 3 above.
5. In the circumstances, the Claimant's case is wholly without merit.

You might want to also add in if you have already notified the claimant that he is perusing the wrong person, as this could be a consideration for the court of costs awarded against him in terms of unreasonable conduct insofar as the claim is completely hopeless and that by continuing to commence proceedings against you personally amounts to unreasonable conduct.

[benken28]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Hi thanks for the post.

The particulars of Claim are on page 1 of this thread.
The last time I heard from him was January via text message saying he is coming to my house at the weekend to speak to me and my wife who had no part in the company this is when I got in touch with the police. I also replied explaining again that the company was a separate entity to me etc and he replied thanks for that. The claim came through the post out of the blue.
I have acknowledged the claim and stated that I will defend it and it needs to be in by the 15th of December.
Ate you suggesting that I write to him as well? If tgis can be avoided I would rather not but if necessary I will. If it went to trial and i won I wouldn't ask for any money from him anyway.

Thanks again

[ostell]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

If it goes to court and when you win ytou will be asking for your costs from him.

[benken28]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Thank you for your reply Do you have to ask for costs? If so how do you know how much they Are?

Thanks again

[GBExile]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

Actually that's not quite true, only a select list set out in the Companies Act can apply to restore the company to the register.
.

Any one who is owned a debt by the struck off company can apply to get the company reinstated if that debt was never disclosed.

Yes it would take money but yes they can do it. Keep in mind this company was not wound up but deserted to avoid obligations.

[benken28]

Re: Small claim court papers receive for a limited company

I wouldn't say the company was deserted but followed the law by ceasing trading as it was insolvent. The only reason it wasn't wound up is because the company didn't have the funds to ly for the process