another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

[getitforless]

Hi all.

Back in December 2014 I started receiving letters from Robinson way in relation to a debt of £5000 from a Santander (abbey credit card). Up to that point I had not received any correspondence from the original lender (Santander) for almost 5 years and my credit reports show that the account with Santander is marked as settled. Upon receiving the letters from Robinson Way I started to scour the internet for advice on how to proceed and came across the goodf website, from which point I began their Common Law Copyright three letter process - I have currently sent two of the letter's and the third is to be sent on Monday, I have received one reply since my last letter stating by internet based templates are of no consequence (which goodf inform people they should expect).

Then, much to my surprise: I received a letter from Howard Cohen yesterday (Dated the 9th) notifying me of pending legal action in relation to the above debt. I have been back to the goodf website to seek further advice, they have recommended that I start their three letter common law copyright process with Howard Cohen and also inform them that I have started a dispute with Robinson Way. My concern is that the notice of pending legal action gives me 10 days from the 9th to respond and I do not understand how I could ever get the three letter process completed in this time (especially when I only received the letter on the 13th!).

Facts:
Original Creditor: Santander (Abbey Credit Card)
DCA: Robinson Way
Solicitor: Howard Cohen
Default Amount: £5000
Default Date: 2010 - no correspondence since
Cannot recollect ever seeing a default notice (although I was a nightmare with paperwork back then!)
Haven't received assignment notice from Santander
Started goodf common law copyright - 2 letters sent - 1 received - last one is going out on Monday
I believe the goodf 3 letter process counts as a CCA to Robinson Way (however they recommended not sending £1?)
Haven't sent CCA to Santander as Credit Report shows their account as settled
Letter from Howard Cohen was digitally signed - dated the 9th - received on the 13th

If anyone could shed any more light on the way I should proceed I would be more than grateful. i.e. is the goodf process is the right one for me now?
And sorry for being long winded, just wanted to clarify as many points as possible in advance of questions.

Thanks in advance!

[Sparkie1723]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Hi getitforless,
If its any help the mark on your credit file means that the agrement has ended ..now that can have two inerpretations.
1. That you have cleared the agreement and you owe no money......OR and this is the one............ that the agreement has been terminated by either the borrower or the lender.
This is the explanation I received fro Equifax CRA when I aksed the question ....what does settled mean.

Sparkie

[Kati]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Hi Getit, welcome to LB!

Unfortunately you will not find anyone on here who can help you with the three letter process (as we have seen time and again it fail), but you will get lots of good advice if you are willing to listen :tinysmile_grin_t:

Firstly, I think you should be sending off CCA to see if they hold any documentation on this debt - if you get them printed off and sent (recorded/signed for post) you should be able to start things off before they get a court claim started.

There are templates that you can adapt for both letters in the quote below:

If you receive a letter from a solicitors or debt collection firm or lender which indicates their intention to issue a court claim against you for the repayment of a debt then you should respond formally to the letter. In some cases this may halt the creditor / solicitors bringing the action against you.

You can respond to say that you are seeking advice from a debt advice provider such as Citizens Advice/StepChange, or inform the potential claimants that you require further information from them in order to consider their claim. It is often a good time to send a formal CCA request for a copy of your credit agreement (if applicable).

There is guidance within the Civil Procedure Rules (the rules which govern how the courts, claimants and defendants handle claims) called the Pre-Action Protocols.

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...on_conduct#9.2 for general information.

7. Exchanging information before starting proceedings

7.1 Before starting proceedings –

(1) the claimant should set out the details of the matter in writing by sending a letter before claim to the defendant. This letter before claim is not the start of proceedings; and

(2) the defendant should give a full written response within a reasonable period, preceded, if appropriate, by a written acknowledgment of the letter before claim.

It also lays out the information that should be given to you in the pre-action letter.

Information to be provided in a debt claim where the claimant is a business and the defendant is an individual

1. Where paragraph 7.4 of the Practice Direction applies the claimant should –

(1) provide details of how the money can be paid (for example the method of payment and the address to which it can be sent);

(2) state that the defendant can contact the claimant to discuss possible repayment options, and provide the relevant contact details; and

(3) inform the defendant that free independent advice and assistance can be obtained from organisations including those listed in the table below.
INDEPENDENT ADVICE ORGANISATIONS
National Debtline Tricorn House FREEPHONE 0808 808 4000 www.nationaldebtline.co.uk
Consumer Credit Counselling Service (CCCS) FREEPHONE 0800 138 1111 www.cccs.co.uk
Citizens Advice Check your local Yellow Pages or Thomson local directory for address and telephone numbers www.citizensadvice.org.uk
Community Legal Advice (formerly Community Legal Services Direct) 0845 345 4345 www.clsdirect.org.uk

2. The information set out in paragraph 1 of this Annex may be provided at any time between the claimant first intimating the possibility of court proceedings and the claimant’s letter before claim.

3. Where the defendant is unable to provide a full response within the time specified in the letter before claim because the defendant intends to seek debt advice then the written acknowledgment should state –

(1) that the defendant is seeking debt advice;

(2) who the defendant is seeking advice from; and

(3) when the defendant expects to have received that advice and be in a position to provide a full response.

4. A claimant should allow a reasonable period of time of up to 14 days for a defendant to obtain debt advice.

5. But the claimant need not allow the defendant time to seek debt advice if the claimant knows that –

(1) the defendant has already received relevant debt advice and the defendant's circumstances have not significantly changed; or

(2) the defendant has previously asked for time to seek debt advice but has not done so.

I'm sure you will get replies/advice from other Beagles too ....

Kati x

[Amethyst]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Good morning,

Welcome to the forum. As Kati has said we don't use the GOODF three letter process as, simply put, it is b*llocks.

So you have a formal letter before action from Rob Way/Howard Cohen regarding a Santander Credit Card account, it's a year off getting to be Stat Barred, you recognise the debt and agree it is owed (as far as I can tell from your post) You haven't mentioned when the card was taken out originally ? any charges/PPI on there?

As Kati has said you need to reply to their LBA and send a formal CCA request with the £1.

We'll try ignore the letters you sent before and hopefully Howard Cohen will too.

Could you post a copy of the LBA up so we can help you draft a reply.

Sharon
xxx

[Nibbler]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Welcome to the forum. As Kati has said we don't use the GOODF three letter process as, simply put, it is b*llocks.

Yes, and dangerous b*llocks as well, as it lands people in trouble like this, or worse.

Luckily getitforless you've come here before too much damage has been done.

[getitforless]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Good morning,

Welcome to the forum. As Kati has said we don't use the GOODF three letter process as, simply put, it is b*llocks.

So you have a formal letter before action from Rob Way/Howard Cohen regarding a Santander Credit Card account, it's a year off getting to be Stat Barred, you recognise the debt and agree it is owed (as far as I can tell from your post) You haven't mentioned when the card was taken out originally ? any charges/PPI on there?

As Kati has said you need to reply to their LBA and send a formal CCA request with the £1.

We'll try ignore the letters you sent before and hopefully Howard Cohen will too.

Could you post a copy of the LBA up so we can help you draft a reply.

Sharon
xxx

Thanks for the prompt responses everyone.

I had a feeling that the three letter process was a shot in the dark!

In answer to you Q's Sharon:
The card was taken out in 2008
No PPI as far as I'm aware - would be good to get hold of a copy of the original credit agreement as it would seem that I have misplaced all paperwork pre 2012.

I'll upload a copy of the LBA in the morning as suggested.

Cheers

[getitforless]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Morning all.

As discussed, I have attached a copy of the LBA for comment.

Look forward to hearing from you.

Cheers

[Nibbler]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

I'm not good with these, but they give a link to the general CPR instead of

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...action_conduct

"refer the defendant to this Practice Direction", i.e. the one on pre-cation conduct.

and falls down on many points here.

2. Claimant’s letter before claim

2.1 The claimant’s letter should give concise details about the matter. This should enable the defendant to understand and investigate the issues without needing to request further information. The letter should include –
(1) the claimant’s full name and address;
(2) the basis on which the claim is made (i.e. why the claimant says the defendant is liable);
(3) a clear summary of the facts on which the claim is based;
(4) what the claimant wants from the defendant; and

(5) if financial loss is claimed, an explanation of how the amount has been calculated.
2.2 The letter should also –
(1) list the essential documents on which the claimant intends to rely;
(2) set out the form of ADR (if any) that the claimant considers the most suitable and invite the defendant to agree to this;
(3) state the date by which the claimant considers it reasonable for a full response to be provided by the defendant; and
(4) identify and ask for copies of any relevant documents not in the claimant's possession and which the claimant wishes to see.
2.3 Unless the defendant is known to be legally represented the letter should –
(1) refer the defendant to this Practice Direction and in particular draw attention to paragraph 4 concerning the court's powers to impose sanctions for failure to comply with the Practice Direction; and
(2) inform the defendant that ignoring the letter before claim may lead to the claimant starting proceedings and may increase the defendant's liability for costs.

[getitforless]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Thanks everyone for all the info provided to date, I really appreciate it.

I'm planning on drafting a response to the LBA tomorrow morning with a view to post it recorded /signed for ASAP. I've taken a copy of the CCA request template from the link that Kati provided.

Any thoughts / comments / experiences are welcomed at this stage. And if there is anything else that you would add to form the response in respect to the LBA that I have attached to this thread, that would be great.

Also in relation to the £1 CCA fee: Is this best sent as a postal order, and if so should I address the payee as Howard Cohen?

Thanks in advance!

[Amethyst]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

The Payee would be the creditor - HPH2 ltd ( Hoist Portfolio Holding 2 Limited ) as they own the debt, are using Robinson way as collectors, who are using Howard Cohen for court threats. The CCA letter should go to HPH2 Ltd - Quays Reach Carolina Way, Salford, M50 2ZY ( same address as Robinson Way )

SO Creditor = Who owns the debt = HOIST
Agent = ROB WAY
Solicitors = Howard Cohen

CCA goes to Creditor
LBA reply goes to solicitor

[getitforless]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Thanks for pointing me in the right direction Sharon.

I will draft a response letter in the morning and upload here for you all to review before sending if thats ok?

One more point in relation to thee CCA fee while I remember:
I have read a few posts on the forums where people have been stung by the DCA's utilising the CCA fee's as payments on their accounts in an attempt to extend period to sb. Is there any sure fire way to avoid this. ie. Marking the postal order etc?

[getitforless]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

Morning Everyone!

Please see the below response letter that I picked up from another thread on here (big thanks to FlamingParrot):

Dear Sirs,

Ref: xxxxxxxx

Thank you for your letter dated 09/02/2015. As the letter contains a threat of litigation, it is being treated as a formal letter before action. As such, I refer you to paragraph 1 of the Practice Direction Pre-Action Conduct, which states the purpose of such a letter is to "enable the parties to settle the issues between them" and to encourage the parties to "exchange information".

Paragraph 2.2 (1) of Annex A states you have an obligation to "list the essential documents on which the Claimant intends to rely". I could not identify such a list in your letter, please list the documents so I can see your case against me and request copies of anything that I may need.

Paragraph 3.2 (3) of Annex A allows me to "request further information to enable me to provide a full response". My request is a request for documents as the information I require would come from those documents. Paragraph 5.1 of Annex A states that you should "provide the documents requested within as short a period of time as is practicable or explain in writing why the documents will not be provided".

I require copies of the following:


The original credit agreement;
The Default Notice;
The Termination Notice;
The Notice of Assignment;
Statements of account;


These documents would be expected to be supplied if proceedings were issued and would likely be in your possession if you were issuing a claim. If you consider that there is difficulty in providing a copy of a document, please identify that document and the reason. Additionally, there is a duty to supply documents under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. A request has been made under s.77-79 on 16/02/2015 and I am awaiting a response.

I shall be able to provide you with a full response to your letter within 14 days of receipt of the documents listed above and also reserve the right to refer to the contents of this letter if proceedings are issued without first providing copy documents to me.

Yours sincerely,

.......................

Is there anything else that you would add / amend in this response letter in respect to the LBA I attached yesterday?

Would you send this via email as well as recorded/signed for?
Would you sign this response letter or simply print name from computer - I have seen a few comments of DCA's copying signatures

Also Q from last nights post:

One more point in relation to thee CCA fee while I remember:
I have read a few posts on the forums where people have been stung by the DCA's utilising the CCA fee's as payments on their accounts in an attempt to extend period to sb. Is there any sure fire way to avoid this. ie. Marking the postal order etc?

[Kati]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

All looks fine to me
As for the postal order ... it should be marked "for statutory fee only" or some such wording

K x

[beaconsman]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

I never had a chance to do that..went from notice of assignment and no notice was served at all...

[getitforless]

Re: another newbie looking for help with / dca's - robinson way & howard cohen

:okay: Kati.

What's everyone's recommendations on signing the CCA / LBA response - ie. hand signature / printed name?

I have seen a few comments of DCA's copying signatures